tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11928317.post6393618913568466154..comments2024-01-29T14:24:46.852-05:00Comments on Wes Ellis: Agnostic Christian?wellis68http://www.blogger.com/profile/06087588494600746854noreply@blogger.comBlogger5125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11928317.post-76883085508829844162009-12-12T17:44:30.504-05:002009-12-12T17:44:30.504-05:00“Solly then” wrote: “The main question is, why fol...“Solly then” wrote: “The main question is, why follow Jesus? ”<br /><br />(le-havdil)I would like to put the <br />question: How to follow the first century Ribi Yehoshua (ha-Mashiakh, the Messiah) from Nazareth??<br /><br />I think that the website <a href="www.netzarim.co.il" rel="nofollow">Netzarim</a> will be of interest to you. It contains logical and scientific research, previously unknown to most Christians, about the first century Ribi Yehoshua (ha-Mashiakh, the Messiah) and what he and his followers taught. His teachings are in accordance with Torah, the instruction manual, of the Creator to humankind. It is an essential read to learn about his teachings!<br /><br />“Solly then” wrote: “The main question is, why follow Jesus? ”<br /><br />(le-havdil)I would like to put the question: How to follow the first century Ribi Yehoshua (ha-Mashiakh, the Messiah) from Nazareth??<br /><br />I think that the website <a href="www.netzarim.co.il" rel="nofollow">Netzarim</a> will be of interest to you. It contains logical and scientific research, previously unknown to most Christians, about the first century Ribi Yehoshua (ha-Mashiakh, the Messiah) and what he and his followers taught. His teachings are in accordance with Torah, the instruction manual, of the Creator to humankind. It is an essential read to learn about his teachings!<br /><br />Anders BranderudAnonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08418091459248577266noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11928317.post-4410349306445067012009-12-10T11:33:20.708-05:002009-12-10T11:33:20.708-05:00Great thoughts. I agree. I will have to check out ...Great thoughts. I agree. I will have to check out Alastair kee's book now. Thanks.wellis68https://www.blogger.com/profile/06087588494600746854noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11928317.post-46347087592563789862009-12-10T06:23:47.992-05:002009-12-10T06:23:47.992-05:00Hi Wes.
In retrospect i guess this was a thought ...Hi Wes.<br /><br />In retrospect i guess this was a thought experiment, rather than a personal statement, now that I have looked at more posts.<br /><br />Still, I think there is a point to be made that in a society where belief in God is rather vague, and not based on the biblical tradition, belief in God might have to come after turning to Jesus. IOW, do we need people to believe in God before they make a decision about Jesus, or can they find God by being interested in him.<br />If by 'doctrine' we mean teaching, then fine, it has it's obvious place as an explanation of what Jesus is about. To many though, doctrine is a set of statements one is required to believe, and those doctrines are not explanation, they are boundary markers.<br />We hope that people are challenged by what Jesus did and said to want to find out the why of it, the explanation. There can't be a loose, generalised following of Jesus; but as i said, we find, as often as not, that the more we concentrate on him, the more we have to unlearn the content we have put into words like 'God', and find out what he meant.<br /><br />I mentioned Alastair kee, who, in his book Way fo Transcendance, seeks to put the gospel into secular terms. This he borrows Tillich's idea of Ultimate Concern. 'God' for him, is what comes to expression in Jesus as ultimate concern, ie, what really matters in the universe.<br /><br />God bless.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11928317.post-15650745468986122642009-12-09T13:37:32.393-05:002009-12-09T13:37:32.393-05:00Solly,then,
Thanks for your thoughts. I do old doc...Solly,then,<br />Thanks for your thoughts. I do old doctrine to be very important but you're right that doctrine is not what it's about. It's about discipleship. Doctrine comes second but it still comes, lest we become incoherent about who Jesus really is and why we're following Him. The answer to your question, "why follow him...", lies somewhere in doctrine. If we don't know what God is doing in the world, if we don't see some alternative which is only possible in God also in Jesus, and if we don't believe that there is something better about the cross-bound life of Jesus, then we'd be hard pressed to find anything worth while about discipleship.<br /><br />Thanks for your thoughts!wellis68https://www.blogger.com/profile/06087588494600746854noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11928317.post-26269599862343658162009-12-08T19:52:58.306-05:002009-12-08T19:52:58.306-05:00Sounds like D Z Philips, but yes, I think you can ...Sounds like D Z Philips, but yes, I think you can be a Christian in such a manner in this current day. My own church holds to the principle 'belong, then believe' If you're stateside, check out the Jesus People.<br />Alastair Kee speaks of seeing in Jesus our Ultimate Concern. Others have spoken of the fact that there is a power for good in the universe, so that certain things matter, like following Jesus.<br /><br />I think the problem is that you are making too hard and fast a distinction between competing versions of 'being a Christian'. Christianity is never, ever, about believing a set of doctrinal propositions, though joining a church may be. Jesus said, follow me, not sign up to me 12 week Alpha course.<br /><br />Starting with Jesus is a very good place; though you might find in time that you take on what he meant by 'God' 'Heaven' etc, which is far better anyway.<br /><br />The main question is, why follow Jesus? Yes, he said some great stuff, and Gandhi rated him highly. But as you say, that road leads to the cross. What really matters in life? What is your ultimate concern? You can as easily go the other way, and make some sort of peripatetic philosopher out of Jesus, a social radical who died for his cause. Why follow him, and not Che?<br /><br />And personally, I wasn't sure I believed in God when I became a Christian.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com